Lilia Mykhailivna, is it true that you hesitated when you accepted the offer to head the Ministry of Education?

I really hesitated. The main reason is the draft basic law "On Education", which will soon be voted on in the parliament. We have finally finalized and prepared this important bill for the first reading. This was preceded by a very wide discussion and intense work. Not only mine and the parliamentary committee, but also a very wide circle of experts, civil society. For me, it is extremely important to bring the case to the end and pass the law in this session of the parliament. But my candidacy was nominated by both factions that created the coalition. Somehow it happened that they did not see an alternative. I decided that this challenge must be accepted, I must go and work where I can really live up to expectations and be more useful.

Did you discuss voting for the law "On Education" in the coalition, agreeing to the minister's seat? Was there such a condition on your part?

I didn't give an ultimatum, because I don't like when people speak the language of ultimatums. I'm used to proving my position. I am convinced that as a minister I will be able to convince the parliament of the need to adopt a revised law. Objectively, it is a mature, high-quality document that provides a real reform in education. I count on the support of people's deputies and public figures in the field of education who defend this law. Even before those forces in the parliament, which, unfortunately, do not share the ideology of the law. In particular, the transition to the new content standards of the 12-year school, oriented to European goals.

How will you work with the specialized parliamentary committee and the National Agency for Quality Assurance of Higher Education (NAZYAVO)? In the first, after you left, in fact, there were no powerful specialists left, in the second - there are odious figures of polished officials, about whom you yourself said that they should not be there.

You are correct about the NAME. The ship named "IN NAME" decided to sail without the slightest coordination with the education system. That's what the people elected there decided. But this is not a way out - through a few people to destroy the body, which is the basis of the system of ensuring the quality of higher education. Blocking the work NAMELY inhibits the creation and launch of independent centers for evaluating the quality of higher education, procedures, as well as the work of people who can fill the new system with new content. NAME we are forced to run in the composition that is chosen. Instead, it is necessary to correct the procedural points, to determine the staffing of this agency by the Cabinet of Ministers resolution, to resolve the organizational matters that were missed.

Serhiy Kvit is considered a specialist in the field of higher education, you - in the field of school education. Do you agree with this assessment?

The minister must work with all education and science. I'm really good at general secondary education, but not only that. During two convocations of the Verkhovna Rada, I head a specialized parliamentary committee. Let me remind you that the new law "On higher education" was finalized at our site, as, by the way, was the new law "On scientific and scientific and technical activities". The key challenges now lie in preschool, general secondary, vocational and technical, and higher education. This is how we must develop the adult education sector. It is necessary to remove Ukrainian science from the sphere of marginalization and build a new system of financing science, which can protect domestic science from the departure of the best scientists abroad. It is necessary to compensate for a certain inattention to these areas. There is a very wide range of tasks.

Whose carelessness should be compensated for?

Education and science are not among the country's priorities. Irrefutable proof of this is their financing. Society in its discourse also does not pay enough attention to education and science. There is no understanding that future generations are built on the basis of education, no matter how pathetic it sounds. I want to say a key thing here. We need a different educational policy that should lead to a European Ukraine. So that every child, regardless of his place of residence, social status, financial support, could receive an education that would give him a chance for a successful life. Today it is not like that. Today, we have better education, better schools, and better teachers for the rich and wealthy. And much worse opportunities for the poor. This deepens and reproduces poverty. Therefore, I believe that European education is the education of the educated general public, and not of a separate elite. And even if the elite manage to give their children an excellent education in good schools, one must understand that these children will then have to live in a divided, impoverished society with a high level of crime and a low level of culture. And all this is decided by education.

There are many problems in the field of education, but which do you consider to be the most acute, where will you start your work as a minister?

There are several very painful questions on which the successful completion of the academic year depends. It is unacceptable that the printing of documents - certificates, certificates - is now under threat. Because tenders for the production of the corresponding forms have not yet been held. The problem with textbooks for the 4th and 7th grades has not yet been resolved. And now the 8th grade will be in danger. I believe that these are the things that must be decided.

Solving these issues, and not only them, requires funds. Funding of education and science is poor. But this parliament, including the committee on education and science, voted for him. What will you do now, where will you look for money?

There was no deficit of educational subvention in the 2016 budget, but there was a wrong decision related to vocational and technical education. And when I asked the question before voting at the budget committee that we cannot transfer vocational and technical education to cities of regional importance, the Ministry of Finance assured me that cities of regional importance have a sufficient revenue part, it listed everything and guaranteed it absolutely clearly. Although we were not shown the numbers. The Ministry of Finance had to conduct a real income forecast. We had no way out then. Now we will have to correct this situation.

There was a problem with the textbooks. The Cabinet Order has now been passed and will be reviewed by the Budget Committee as soon as possible so that we have funding for 8th grade textbooks. If we talk about financing as a whole, then in our country today this indicator is 5.2% of GDP. This is a very low indicator for our country. I will ask the government that part of the funds received from the over-execution of the state budget in the revenue part should be directed to urgent needs in the education system. We need to review the policy of financing education and science. As for science, I am convinced that we should make it dependent on qualitative indicators. That is, we need to change the mechanism, and not follow the path of simply reducing the amount of money.

You will have to introduce reforms, the broad support of which is not guaranteed in society (for example, 12 river, optimization of schools). But for you, they will carry serious reputational risks. Will you go for it?

We have a huge informational work ahead of us. We have to explain what a 12-year school is and why in the European Union a person must get a school education by the age of 18. Another thing is that we need to diversify these opportunities for a person so that he can acquire a profession during a three-year senior professional education. This is how education is organized in the European Union, because it allows children and adolescents to be prepared for life in the society of the XXI century. And this requires new content and more study time. Ukrainian schoolchildren are no worse than their peers from Great Britain, Finland or Poland. Therefore, we will not back down, even though it will be difficult.

And the optimization of schools, particularly rural schools?

We have signed a memorandum with the IMF, adopted a budget that states the need to optimize schools with fewer than 25 students. Then there were 800 schools. During the adoption of the budget, I insisted that optimization should not apply to primary schools. Thus, there are significantly fewer schools that need to be optimized. But I hope that we will coordinate our plans with the Ministry of Regional Development. They have resources, for example, to repair roads, develop hospital and educational districts. Only when there is a road, a bus, and a better school to which children can be transported, can a small rural school be closed.

Will you leave the old team of deputies and heads of departments in the Ministry of Education, or will you come there with your team?

We will return to the question of the team a little later. It will include both those currently working in the ministry and new people. There is a strategic vision and an action plan. But it takes time to decide on a detailed overview of the problems and the most urgent priorities. First - problems and tasks, then - specialists with specific names to solve these tasks.

Oksana Onyschenko, newspaper "Mirror of the week".